One of the best hours of television I’ve seen in a long time. Wasn’t disappointed in the final cylon reveal at all — and the questions around Starbuck makes things even more interesting. Plenty of “Holy Frak!” moments, and Dee was the best one. Purely awesome.
MAJOR SPOILERS AWAIT… Read the full review!
WHY ELLEN MAKES SENSE
So just when I was sold on Starbuck being the final cylon, Ron Moore and company go and pull Ellen Tigh out in the last minute! Plenty of opinions being thrown out about this, so here’s mine: not a bad choice. Here’s why:
1. When Ellen showed up out of nowhere in Episode 1.9 (“Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down”), there were always major questions surrounding her sudden appearance. Tigh thought she was dead, left behind in the attack on Picon. This was when Baltar was developing his cylon detector, and Adama ordered that Ellen be the first to be tested. Baltar tells Adama she passed, but there was plenty of ambiguity as to whether he was telling the Admiral the truth… In fact, Baltar indicates to Number Six that he may have lied.
2. Martial Law. Remember when the Old Man got shot and Saul tried leading the fleet? It was Ellen pulling the strings, convincing him to declare martial law and threaten the idea of human liberty. What did she care? She was a frakkin’ toaster!
3. The New Caprica resistance. Ellen was sabotaging the human resistance on New Caprica, effectively working for the cylons while sleeping with one of them. And coincidentally, the three major characters that led the resistance (Tigh, Anders, and Tyrol) were all revealed to be cylons.
4. The Last Supper. Mystery has swirled around the infamous BSG Last Supper image featured with a Ron Moore interview in Entertainment Weekly last year.
“We have not yet revealed the final [unknown] Cylon.” Does that mean the people already at the table aren’t the final cylon? Moore laughs. “You ferreted that out pretty slyly. I didn’t really want to give that away.”
So, the final cylon isn’t pictured. And look who’s missing from an empty chair right next to… Tigh.
5. Tigh’s “hallucinations” of Number Six as Ellen when he confronted her in her holding cell in episode 4.6 (“Escape Velocity”).
Funny how it seems obvious in hindsight, right? The most important thing to me is that it makes sense. It was thought out. Thank you, writers, for not choosing Hot Dog or Gaeta for absolutely no reason!
WHY DEE BLASTING HERSELF IS AWESOME
Because somebody had to. The sheer hopelessness of the fleet’s situation can’t just be conveyed by graffiti that reads “Frak Earth”. It was a strong choice, especially after seeing her reconcile with Lee.
SO WHAT’S UP WITH STARBUCK?
Wormhole? Time travel? 13 tribes = 13 cylons? It was brilliant when even Leoben freaked out!
This episode succeeded in blowing away my expectations, and my expectations are always high for BSG. It looks like it’s going to be one hell of a ride to the finale. Are you ready? Did you like the choices? Are you confused? Excited? Pissed off?
Related:
Battlestar Galactica Episode 4.12 Review
Battlestar Galactica Episode 4.13/4.14 Review
Battlestar Galactica Episode 4.15 Review
Battlestar Galactica Episode 4.16 Review
Battlestar Galactica Episode 4.17 Review
Battlestar Galactica Episode 4.18 Review
Ellen was a smart choice, but still felt a little easy. It was cool how it brought back her initial introduction into the fleet, which was always suspicious… but I had totally fallen under the “Lost” spell with BSG by this point, and almost no recognizable choice would have satisfied my curiosity.
Starbuck was never an option in my eyes, especially when D’Anna (Xena Warrior Princess) said “the 5th is not with the fleet” in Season 4.0.
I had forgotten that quote of D’Anna — good call. I was still holding out a little hope it would be Baltar, just because he’s awesome, but he works better as the human-prophet-guru-scientist anyway. Very interested to see where this leads…
Yeah, there was a half hour episode in the afternoon called “10 things you need to know so far”, that had the writers/creators… and they said Baltar’s character was the “most human” of everyone (so deeply flawed, guilt-ridden, etc..), which ruled him out for me. Plus, he’s just too perfect in his role… of course someone like that would be responsible for our demise…
… I’m looking at you, great-grandson of Nar Williams, A.I. scientist extraordinaire.. responsible for making SkyNet self-aware.
Awesome As Always Nar.
When D’Anna said “the 5th is not with the fleet” my mind went right to Cali. I felt like the final Cylon had to be dead. But once they said it was Ellen then it all clicked.
But now that we know that Cylons can age. Can Six be a young Ellen? Because Cylons can only have babies if they are in love. Sal us in love with Ellen and see’s Ellen when he looks at Six.
Also how long do you think a Cylon can live as one copy.
Great review and even better insight Nar. When I first watched the episode, I thought the choice of Ellen was somewhat desperate on the writers part. However, after reading your review I feel a little disappointed in myself for not picking up on all the clues they provided us. It gives me hope that the writers really do have a master plan to draw this roller-coaster to a close in a respectable way.
I bookmarked your page after finding it through the comments section on EW.
That was one of the best episodes ever! I was totally shocked by Duella! I was convinced that, with the amount of air time she was getting, and the way she was behaving, that she was going to be the Fifth! That would have been too easy. Of course the whole Starbuck-in-a-Viper scene was mind frakking! Why did Leoban run? My personal theory is that Starbuck is the reborn Ellen. We are in for a hell of a ride!
Wow. Love the ideas, everybody. Starbuck as the reborn Ellen; Ellen as an older Number Six; my great-grandson as the creator of Skynet (lol Soul)!
Thanks everybody for bookmarking my page. I look forward to discussing this season with all of you.
I was intrigued by the fact that the 13th colony was cylons on Earth. A theme throughout the series has been “all of this has happened before”. Last night’s episode was the first peek at the proposed cyclical nature of the BSG universe. Right now it seems as if it is human nature to build cylons, and cylon nature to forget they are cylon and believe they are human.
What do you think? Any theories?
Your post led me to an idea. Starbuck is the Space Baby.
You said “13 Tribes, 13 Models?” Maybe so. “All of this has happened before and will happen again” is the mantra of the Cylon, but what if this is the introduction of an additional model, one even they weren’t aware of?
What if Starbuck’s existence as a Cylon was not even known to them, to Leobhan and the rest? What if it’s the next step in the Cylon evolution? What if she’s the Space Baby?
You’re right, though. Best television evar. What other television program makes me spend the next entire day obsessing about it?
LOL… this episode repeats tomorrow at 3 PM PST in Canada! I can’t wait to see it again! LOL
You’re right, Brady — there is no other show that sends my head spinning and finds me obsessing the rest of the week.
Maybe Starbuck is the first hybrid — and therefore can be reborn like a cylon. It’s always seemed strange how Leoben obsesses over Kara and her destiny. What’s the connection? Is Leoben Starbuck’s cylon daddy??
BTW.. my theory: Based on the song, “All Along The Watchtower”, the nuking of Earth happened in OUR immediate future. So that means Galactica came here about 2,000 years in our future. So, maybe our tinkering with genetic engineering and the like created these cylons? I was taken by surprise by the Centurion head… different than what the Cylon models recognized… All of this has happened before…
1. When Ellen showed up out of nowhere in Episode 1.9 (”Tigh Me Up, Tigh Me Down”): Couldn’t this reason fit for almost anyone who survived the initial attack? Of the billions killed 50,000 survived. That makes everyone “special”. Also, the cylon detector/baltar reasoning is totally bunk. So you are saying he knew all along who one of the “final five” was? How about when the 4 were revealed to the fleet in “Revelations”. According to your logic Baltar knew the 5th right then and there but told no one and did not act on the information.
Baltar didn’t know she was the 5th, and it is doubtful that his detector ever identified the “final five” which, as Moore says, are “fundamentally different”. Furthermore, I suppose we must also assume that Baltar tested Tory (who was in the fleet at the time), Tigh, and Tyrol. The only wildcard is Anders who showed up later. Again, according to your logic Baltar knew all along who 4 of the final 5 were. Doubtful.
2. Martial Law: How does Ellen trying to pull the strings make her “make sense” as a Cylon?
3. The New Caprica resistance: So Ellen sabotaging the human resistance makes her “make sense” as a Cylon. You further say that the other three “led the resistance” which makes them “make sense” as Cylons. Counterintuitive, no?
4. The Last Supper: So you are using promotions and ads to tell you what makes the most sense for the series. Because of a photo and Moore’s comments you think Ellen is a good choice? I think what you mean to say is, it would make sense for Ellen to be the final Cylon based on the clues and comments dropped by Moore & Co. This point has absolutely nothing to do with Ellen “making sense” in the grand mythology of the show.
5. Tigh’s “hallucinations” of Number Six as Ellen: Again, I really don’t see how this “makes sense” for her to be the final Cylon. Tigh hallucinated, and Six looks like Ellen anyway.
It seems to me the writers decided on Ellen, then decided that they would do the hallucination/relationship thing with Tigh so that it would look like it was all obvious from the start.
What we need to remember is that the final Cylons are totally different from the toasters and skinjobs (which is becoming ever more obvious). That said, we don’t really know what a skinjob is. They are, and also have been, remarkably similar to normal humans save for a few things…
1) Downloading into new bodies
2) The stupid electronic plug-in thing in their hands
3) Glowing spines
4) Here-again gone-again superhuman strength.
Bottom line is the writers could do whatever they hell they want with this show next and it could probably “make sense”. Look back to the end of season 1 and look how totally different the story is to what is going on now. Same with season’s 2 and 3. This is a vast story, and that I love, but don’t try to explain how it all “fits” when really anything could have happened and with good enough writing anything could “fit”.
Great post, though I disagree about Ellen being a “great choice”. Anyone could’ve fit the final cylon in retrospect (except anyone who had suffered from radiation sickness- didn’t Anders look awfully healthy back on Caprica? But Helo looked like he was about to die… knocked Helo off my list). Also did anyone notice that out of all the people that spent the most time on radiated “earth” Starbuck (I believe) was the only “human” that spent the night there- everyone else appeared to be Cylon. If I’m wrong on this please correct me! Dee was insane- and I found it waaay out of character for her. The actress did an excellent job though- kudos her. Ellen just annoyed me. And I think Gaeta would’ve been in the perfect position to be the final Cylon- made much more sense logically and story-wise (unless I am completely off track on this thing) and he knew the Cylon song! What was that all about? Oh well more will be revealed!
Random guess here but … all of this has happened before, therefore the death of Helen, caused by Saul himself (after all, it’s not like we’re shown what brings her there in Saul’s memory flash), has happened before… Curiously, during the previous nuclear war… I’m inclined to think Helen is just a regular Number Six, and that we are being mislead.
Ellen was a great choice.
I have been thinking about her time on New Caprica.
Saul, Ander, and Tyrol where all fighting the known Cylons, so was this the first stage of the Cylon civil war? Did Ellen see a riff in the Cylon rule?
She always was pulling the strings.
I’m kinda mad that I missed the clues, mainly the over sex drive of the female Cylons.
I miss #4 and #5 I hope they show up again on this last part of the journey.
Almost forgot did anyone else hear about the KFC “Frack Pack”?
Do the monkeys over at KFC even know what “Frack”means?
I think they don’t have a Frackin clue.
All I know is that a “Frack Pack” in Las Vegas cost about $800 bucks or so I’ve heard.
I’m not hear to bash, but unlike most comments here, I don’t see what’s so great about your post.
First of all, you assume that the 5th cylon, Ellen, knows what she is. There is no reason to believe that. Everything seems to indicate she’s just like the last 4, and never knew it. We figured the 5th cylon was special because it was revealed so late, but maybe it was in fact simply because she’s already dead.
And then, “Dee blasting herself is awesome because somebody had to?”. Come on, that’s your reason? Then the real question is why her? In my sense, because her story arc was over, and she wouldn’t really be missed…
Still, great episode.
^ Dude you are so funny!
….wow.
Un Francais,
Your question regarding Dee is a valid one: why her? Like Debby says in a comment above, it’s “waaay out of character for her”. Which is part of what makes it great writing.
My view is throughout the series Dee has been an extremely positive and optimistic character. She consistently provided Lee and Admiral Adama with motivation for strength to persevere. She even gave Lee an inspiring talk in this episode, to give him hope and courage to address the fleet. So when one of the most optimistic, “strongest” characters gives up and commits suicide it REALLY hits home how desperate the situation is. Don’t you think?
Nar, I agree with your last comment on Dee. The thing is, I feel they went “straight to the jugular” with the suicide. It would have made a little more sense if you saw the crew falling apart, fighting in the halls, crying, etc. THEN Dee kills herself. Instead it was the other way around.
*Shrug* Not that I totally disagree with the Dee point, she annoyed the heck out of me and I’m glad she’s out of the picture. I can’t help but think the way the writers dealt with this was just to add some shock value to the episode.
And in that respect, they succeeded.
RP,
I am definitely assuming that Ellen knew she was a cylon. She says in this episode in the flashback that “a plan is in place”. I could be totally wrong, but that’s the assumption I’m working from. So doesn’t it make sense she’d want to destroy the fleet from the inside out by manipulating Saul, implementing martial law, endangering the fleet’s stability, leaking resistance plans, etc.?
As far as the resistance fighters turning out to be cylons, etc… yeah I’m gonna have to give you some counterintuitive points there. LOL.
I disagree on the notion that the writers could of made anyone work as the final cylon — really? Hot Dog? The I-Smoke-in-the-ER-Doctor? RDM and the writers have clearly shown foresight here (including the last supper promo) in giving clues as to who the final cylon would be — they didn’t just pull it out of their collective asses. To that I say, “yay”.
Nar,
In response,
“I am definitely assuming that Ellen knew she was a cylon…So doesn’t it make sense she’d want to destroy the fleet from the inside out by manipulating Saul, implementing martial law, endangering the fleet’s stability, leaking resistance plans, etc.?”
Remember that we don’t know anything about the Final Five. They are trying to find a place in this whole mess. Tory sided with the cylons…but now that portion of the cylons are in alliance with the humans. The Final Five are just as human as any of the other members of the fleet. We don’t need to jump to the assumption that cylon = bad guy, especially with the Final Five. She wasn’t trying to destroy the fleet, neither was Tory, Tigh, or Anders. She was just as flawed as any human being.
Also, why would she know she was a Cylon? None of the other finals knew until the end of season 3. If she knew she was a Cylon that would have at least been evident to the viewers…and they would have leveraged off that to create drama. Thus, just as the writers didn’t decide she was the Final until late, neither did Ellen ‘know’ she was the Final until she was ‘dead’.
“I disagree on the notion that the writers could of made anyone work as the final cylon — really?”
Sure, have Roslin have a repeating flashback during Season 3 where Hot Dog somehow saves her in the forest (a la the marines running around her in her dream during Flesh and Blood [Season 1]). Show that a few times, give him a little more screen time, then reveal him as the Final Cylon and it “all makes sense”.
You have to understand that the Last Supper picture is, as you said, a ‘promo’ meant to ‘promote’ the show. That picture was created after the last cylon was determined, and not before. It doesn’t all ‘fall into place’ because of that picture. Rather, they chose the final cylon THEN created the promo.
But really, arguing this point doesn’t really further any understanding of the show or its mythology so…moving on…
Hopefully you’ll be reviewing future episodes, I’ll be back to check it out.
Thanks RP! It’s great to have your perspective!
Regarding the phophecy spoken by the hybrid to Kara Thrace aboard the bay ship0. Kara Thrace is an Angel of God. Remember in the last episode of season4- whe told Sam that ” she didn’t know what she was anymore and that she felt like she was not in her body”! She will lead them to their end-the promised land- on her wings. Viper wings! The death she harbors is her own.
I also think Ellen could be an older version of Six, and Saul may even have sensed it when Six said “Do you see we’re the same?”. That would of course mean there’s another unknown model, someone who’s dead or who was hostage on the base star when D’Anna said “there are four in the fleet”.
As for Dee, what was it that she picked up on earth just before she broke down? Lee found in her belongings at the end of the episode, and I can’t help thinking it’s going to prove significant in some way. Maybe the knowledge of what it meant is what pushed her over the edge.
Silver Actual
Enough about the episode.
What about the “Frack Pack”?
That’s the real question here.
Who wants a “Frack Pack”?
Are they for a limited time?
Are they available on all colonies?
Will a final piece of chicken be revealed in the “Frack Pack”? And will that piece know it’s part of the “Frack Pack”.
Does FKC thinks Sci Fi geeks eat that much chicken?
I want to see their market research study on that one.
KFC might do chicken right but they sure don’t do sci fi movie tie ins right.
Kara Thrace might be the harbinger of Death, but Colonel Sanders, not Colonel Saul is the harbinger of frackin’ finger licking good chicken.
the writers decided on the final five at the same time, including ellen, per their writers:
David Weddle: “We decided to make Ellen one of the Final Five at the same time that we chose the other Final Five at the end of Season Three. The decision was primarily made by Ron Moore, though all of the writers weighed in.”
Bradley Thompson: “We can take two roads from here – lie and say it was all planned from the get-go, or tell the truth, which is the story grew organically from what we’d set up – a practice some have called ‘ret-conning.’ We looked at the characters and their stories to date, we examined the potential for surprising but ‘right’ storytelling. We looked at which characters would be tortured the most by that turn of fate. And the room put the names on the board. Ron said, ‘Go sleep on it.’ Next day, they were the Final Five.”
i did wonder at starbuck being the harbinger of death, if maybe it applied to the death of cylons, since it was because of HER they were able to find and destroy the resurrection hub, making resurrection impossible and death every cylon’s destiny.
This is a great thread. Thanks to Nar and everyone else.
Tommy, Dee picked up some jacks, a common girls toy that helped kids develop hand-eye coordination before everyone started playing video games. You drop a rubber ball, then try to pick up as many jacks as possible before the ball hits the ground a second time. (You’re making me feel old.)
I’m wondering if cylons (13th tribe variety) might be a closely related species or even a subspecies. Imagine if neanderthals had survived and we had two “human” species. I agree with the person who said they’re different than skinjobs. And I wonder if there have been some earth-variety cylons in the colonies for thousands of years.
It will be interesting to see where this all ends up. I can’t believe it will all be over in another nine episodes. I don’t know what I’ll watch then. Sanctuary is OK but doesn’t really do it for me.
Lifeguard1: I think you’re on to something with the subspecies theory. Makes sense to me that cylons would evolve, just as humans evolve — and perhaps faster because their designed to be more efficient?
Regarding Dee: If you think about the jacks that Dee found and kept, then her interaction with young Hera, then her gaze at the photo of herself as a child — perhaps she was realizing that there would be no next generation of humans, no hope for her to have a child and see it grow. She mentions twice “you have no idea what’s happening” and again “she had no idea what was ahead” (I’m paraphrasing). So tragic to see such a hopeful character dwell on the loss of childhood innocence and kill herself because of it. Again, great writing.
Silverwakeboarder: LOL! After the heavy stuff being thrown at us by RDM and company, I look forward to having your ongoing commentary to lighten things up around here!
You raise a good question, Silver: do Sci-Fi Geeks eat that much fried chicken? I know I could kill a Frak Pack right about now.
One thing still nags at me and makes me think that Ellen isn’t really the final Cylon. Remember when D’Anna saw the faces of the final five in the temple? At the last one she says something like, “You? I… I had no idea.” There is almost a little reverance in her voice, like the person was someone of importance. I don’t see how Ellen fits with that scene. It is because of that scene that I have thought the final one must be someone like Apollo, Starbuck, Roslin, Adama, or even Tom Zarek. (I’ve often thought about the creepy lawyer guy that worked with Lee on Baltar’s trial, but he wouldn’t make much sense either – still, I wonder what the heck was up with that guy?) Think about it, D’Anna is gazing upon the faces of the final five for the first time and one of them causes her to be surprised enough to make that comment. Ellen just doesn’t jive with that, IMHO.
I thought maybe the final scene outing Ellen could be just another hallucination from Tigh but all the interviews after the show aired confirm Ellen as the 5th.
I think it’s somewhat odd that the 5th’s identity still wasnt known until the break between season 3 and 4. They went into a room and said “who’s the 5th”? and then made it fit?
I’m not sure how I feel about that. On one hand, you like the organic nature of what that means but then on the other it’s like “what?? you didnt know ahead of time? WTF?”
To answer Kevin’s question, one of the interviews states that they intended D’Anna to be talking to Ellen when she said that.
That tells me that Ellen does something actually important between now and the end of the show because I agree with Kevin that nothing thus far would justify that kind of response.
Hey #31, why are you thinking that D saw Ellen? Wouldn’t it make much more sense that Ellen saw Saul? Who had been seriously tortured and even had an eye yanked out during torture? Or Anders who she tried to kill in a previous episode.
I meant that wouldn’t it make more sense that D’anna (Not Ellen, typo) saw Saul.
I’m a little surprised no one has brought this up, but here’s my theory on Starbuck. Forget the pre-supposition that she was the fifth of the final five. It was the obvious choice given all the supposed clues and her apparent resurrection. Fortunately the producers went another way, a perhaps more logical and even human direction by making Tigh’s wife the fifth of the final five. . .
With all this talk of the cylons believing in the one true God, is it too much of a leap to think that Starbuck is their version of the devil? Recall Leoben’s reaction to seeing her body in the crashed Viper – he sure as frak knew what she is . . .
Great thread, been looking for a lively discussion of an amazing episode.
Here is a question no one seems to be addressing; assuming Ellen is the 5th, shouldn’t she have been resurrected after Saul poisons her on New Caprica? Remember, De’anna said the 5th was not with the fleet; it makes perfect sense that Ellen is alive and well somewhere on a Cylon ship, and De’anna knows this.
Regarding Starbuck, she seems to be at the nexus of the cycle. Humans and Cylons changing roles; master and servant, aggressor and refugee- these are constantly changing, but Starbuck seems to be a constant in all of this. Any thoughts?
I felt that D commited suicide when she did because she knew that it was probably the happiest moment she was ever going to have for the rest of her life. I felt she killed herself because it WAS a happy moment and she wanted it to last forever. It didn’t feel pre-meditated but completely impulsive. Pretty heartbreaking but it sure put the hopelessness regarding Earth in perspective for the audience.
I really like how intelligent this blog is concerning the show. Good job everyone.
In reference to episode 4.11:
I think that this episode draws more questions that it answers. Sure I’m happy that the final cylon was revealed, but Ellen? I wasn’t expecting that. That revalation alone makes me wonder…
So if Ellen’s dead and is a cylon, where is she now? I know that the skinjob copies download into a hub then into a resurrection ship, but they download into identical bodies to the ones that they just left. If some of the assumptions are correct above and the new Kara is a reincarnated Ellen then why does she only remember being Starbuck? Is there a resurrection hub of some sort near New Caprica stocked with new Ellen/Kara bodies, or even bodies of the other Final Five? Where’d Kara’s new Viper come from?
If all this is true then “something is orchestrating this for a reason” as Kara herself said in Episode 4.10 [Revalations].
And that’s just the tip of the iceberg of questions I have in relation to the single fact that Ellen is the Fifth of the Final Five.
On a sad, shallow sidenote of mine… I was also sad to see Kandyse McClure leave the show. Not just because her character was awesome and a much-needed inspiration to the other characters (which it definitely was) but mostly because…
SHE WAS THE HOTTEST GIRL ON THE SHOW!!
Sigh, oh well… I guess I still have Laura Roslin to pine after… *shiver*
My fellow Sci-Fi crazies… Starbuck is a Cylon and so was Dee. Dee picked up the jacks because it was her memory just as the other Cylons had memories of past experiences on Earth. Just a thought.
Ron: I watched the episode a second time and had a similar thought… Dee seems to be having a memory like the others, which means she’d be a cylon…
Chris: Wow. What a great idea — Starbuck as the devil. It would explain why Leoben freaks out! We know they believe in one true god, but does anyone know if the cylons have a belief in a “satan”?
Yes they do Nar… It’s called Windows Vista…
[...] have the first cylon/cylon baby. This plot development could lend some credence to the theories in last week’s episode thread set forth by Jules, Tommy and others that Ellen is an older model of Six. Why was Tigh so obsessed [...]
I guess that the final five don’t resurrect like the first seven and therefore there is no reborn Ellen (at least not until the next cycle, perhaps).
I wonder how the 13th tribe came to be however. Who build the first cylons?
My guess is that they were build by The Lords of Kobol and later on divided in thirteen divisions/tribes. This means that all tribes were cylon and that the lords were the original “humans”.
Maybe those tribes were abused in the same way the later cylons (iteration 2) were abused by the colonies, as slaves, and left to get a life of their own.
I also guess this is the origin of the ban on any research into the final five by the cylons stems from this. They would have to acknowledge that they were killing there own race.
What’s left though is why everyone forgot there origin as cylons? How do the raiders and centurions fit into the cylon race? They seem to be seperate, certainly if you imagine that the first of the (iteration 2) cylons is a humanoid in the form of Zoe-R and not a centurion.
To summarize things this is the cycle as I suspect it to be:
Iteration 1:
- The Lords of Kobol create a race of artificial humanoids.
- The artificial humanoids divide into separate tribes.
- One tribes leaves toward Earth, possibly to escape slavery. Later on they forget there origin and even create there own robots (centurions).
- Two thousand years later the tribe on Earth gets nuked by some unknown aggressor. Maybe by the Lords of Kobol who find them.
- Around the same time the other tribes leave Kobol. Maybe as a protest against the destruction of Earth. In case the destruction was not caused by the lords they may have left for other reasons. This would also solve the problem of the worship of the lords, which would be illogical in the case it was a protest.
- The tribes arrive at twelve planets and form the colonies. In time they also forget there origins. Perhaps they hide there origin on purpose from future generations.
Iteration 2:
- Two thousand years later they begin to construct artificial humanoids (Zoe-R) themselves and call them cylon. At the same time centurions are developed. Soon they will be treated as slaves and the name applies to both groups. Almost nobody knows of the existence of the humanoids at this time however, thus in practice the name is applied to centurions only.
- A short time later a war breaks out between the colonies and the cylons.
- An armistice is declared and the cylons leave the space of the colonies. At this time the humanoids begin to rise in significance among the cylons. They differ from the iteration 1 variety (“humans”) in that there is a limited amount of models which are copied and cannot permanently die.
- The cylons, guided by the humanoids destroy the colonies.
I know this is pure speculation, however this would explain the cycles without having to resort to higher powers. It would also explain why the final five where so difficult to detect: they were the same as the rest of the fleet.
Though they were able to tell that the bodies on Earth were cylon, it could be that they refined the detection method with the help of the rebel cylons and that they simply did not apply the test to the rest of the fleet yet.
What does the rest think of this?
I’m always wrong about this show, but I tend to lean towards the Ellen-as-aged-six theory. The cylons we know about so far are all very different “types”; so why have the final cylon be very physically — and temperamentally — similar to another model?
Of course, from what some of you have posted above, it sounds like the actress who plays Ellen and various people involved in the show have confirmed that Ellen is the Fifth. Then again, who says they have to tell us the truth . . .?
Regardless, it’s entirely anticlimactic unless:
1) Ellen returns, or
2) Ellen is not the fifth (or at least not the last) cylon.
As for Starbuck, I just don’t know. I don’t think BSG would introduce something entirely new to the mythology at this late date (e.g. — time travel), so she has to be explicable based on what we already know. But the only resurrections we know can (or at least could) occur are those of cylons. But I think Starbuck’s character is less interesting if she turns out to be a cylon. Besides, supposedly all the cylons are outed now. Unless Ellen’s a red herring . . . and now we’re back where we started.
Screw it. Like Lost, I’m going to stop trying to figure stuff out and just enjoy the ride. I just hope the sum is as great as its parts!
Did you people not see Starbuck (well a copy) in that crashed viper on so called Earth? That means there were two. Or somehow, her and her viper got copied and crashed on Earth. I knwo they are calling this planet Earth but has that really been confirmed? I also believe it has been assumed all along that Earth consisted of humans. Another problem with this being Earth is that the moon and Mars would have been developed to some degree with advanced technology.
Even though I have been extremely entertained by this shows drama, its Scfi is actually a little weak.
In the original 2 series (BSG1/Galatica 1980), they were visited by the “Ship of Lights”. The ship of lights was inhibited by a race of beings that possessed technology far superior to the technology known to the 12 colonies (also referred to by the Lords of Kobold as angles). In Original episode “War of the Gods Part 2 ” the beings from the ship of lights brought Apollo back from the dead. It would not have been far fetched to assume that this is what is happened to Starbuck, since her viper seems to have shown up as being “brand new off the show room floor”, with the signal that lead them to Earth. The beings on the Ship of Lights referred to Apollo being dead by primitive standards, and restored him to a living state. Beings of this tech would have no problem creating a viper that was as if it was brand new off the show room floor and a signal that would show them the way to Earth This would explain how Kara is a living being as supposed to being a recreated cylon. Many concepts have been taken the original and the horrible 1980′s series including the idea of cylon’s being look-a-like humans. But it would not be a surprise to me, if the Ship of Lights was brought into the current story line explain the events that have happened with Kara.
In re to Ellen…..she herself said that she will be “reborn”. So to say that she is a Six model…that is kinda off the wall. Since the six’s are reincarnated. It is more likely to say that she is the child that the Six is carrying, or someone yet unseen. Since the child she is carrying is product of a cylon (Six)/cylon (Ty) relationship. Which is unheard of in the Cylon world. Especially since the first, and only, human/cylon hybrid is Hara.
Just some food for thought…….
Probably as NASA is sending out probes all over the galaxy one of them encountered a wormhole or whatever see startrek cause the jedi crew dont even teleport lol and somehow or the other finds the colonies btw what is the 13th planet???, anyways the final five were those who knew what they were but as humans I will never believe that the manufacturers would stop at only five I for one wouldnt like to a Boomer model and then R u Boomer? everytime we meet up….
It also doesn`t answer the question of where exactly did the first of the twelve colonies come from???